Comments on: The Shyftr Saga http://www.blogherald.com/2008/04/14/the-shyftr-saga/ The leading source of news covering social media and the blogosphere. Sun, 12 Feb 2012 21:12:36 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Lorelle VanFossen http://www.blogherald.com/2008/04/14/the-shyftr-saga/comment-page-1/#comment-408481 Lorelle VanFossen Tue, 15 Apr 2008 06:48:37 +0000 http://www.blogherald.com/2008/04/14/the-shyftr-saga/#comment-408481 @<a href="http://www.blogherald.com/2008/04/14/the-shyftr-saga/#comment-408361" rel="nofollow">Jonathan Bailey</a>: Good example with Digg and Reddit. These are places where peer-to-peer social sharing pays off, in their own way, with conversations about the content, but little or no copyright abuse - though I have actually found copies of my content on splog sites who submitted my stolen content to Digg as if it was their own...*SIGH* @Jonathan Bailey:

Good example with Digg and Reddit. These are places where peer-to-peer social sharing pays off, in their own way, with conversations about the content, but little or no copyright abuse – though I have actually found copies of my content on splog sites who submitted my stolen content to Digg as if it was their own…*SIGH*

]]> By: Jonathan Bailey http://www.blogherald.com/2008/04/14/the-shyftr-saga/comment-page-1/#comment-408361 Jonathan Bailey Tue, 15 Apr 2008 04:56:29 +0000 http://www.blogherald.com/2008/04/14/the-shyftr-saga/#comment-408361 Raoul: If what you say is true, and it appears to be, then you are right to not be appeased. It should not matter how many comments are displayed on a post, the full feed should not be used. I agree completely. That is not listening to the complaints of bloggers and I will be following up on that... Mark: I agree. It is strange to me considering that Shyftr, though problematic, is not the worst site I've seen of its kind. However, it really did open the can so to speak and I think the conversation element was the catalyst. Ram: It seems the situation continues to evolve. I'm going to follow it and probably post more about it on my site later this week. Michael: I'm really not sure if there is any "safe" way to republish full feeds but I do agree that their actions around it only made the situation worse. I always put the emphasis on symbiosis. Digg and Reddit are actually great models for how to build sites and reputations using other people's content, without ripping them off. I think the system is pretty solid in those cases. Lorelle: Agreed on all fronts. Hopefully we can find ways to speed up the asking process so that it is more practical, but it is an important element both legally and ethically. Hopefully, this dialog can help us all move forward and come to some kind of consensus and standard for how these issues should be handled. A guy can dream... Raoul: If what you say is true, and it appears to be, then you are right to not be appeased. It should not matter how many comments are displayed on a post, the full feed should not be used. I agree completely.

That is not listening to the complaints of bloggers and I will be following up on that…

Mark: I agree. It is strange to me considering that Shyftr, though problematic, is not the worst site I’ve seen of its kind. However, it really did open the can so to speak and I think the conversation element was the catalyst.

Ram: It seems the situation continues to evolve. I’m going to follow it and probably post more about it on my site later this week.

Michael: I’m really not sure if there is any “safe” way to republish full feeds but I do agree that their actions around it only made the situation worse. I always put the emphasis on symbiosis.

Digg and Reddit are actually great models for how to build sites and reputations using other people’s content, without ripping them off. I think the system is pretty solid in those cases.

Lorelle: Agreed on all fronts. Hopefully we can find ways to speed up the asking process so that it is more practical, but it is an important element both legally and ethically.

Hopefully, this dialog can help us all move forward and come to some kind of consensus and standard for how these issues should be handled.

A guy can dream…

]]> By: Lorelle VanFossen http://www.blogherald.com/2008/04/14/the-shyftr-saga/comment-page-1/#comment-408275 Lorelle VanFossen Tue, 15 Apr 2008 03:24:30 +0000 http://www.blogherald.com/2008/04/14/the-shyftr-saga/#comment-408275 I echo the thanks, Jonathan. The issue for me is not just controlling where my content goes, but controlling who makes money from my content, especially content that comes from my WordPress.com blog, from which I cannot make direct income. The abusers of my content can. Such usage breaks the "Ask First" manners of the web, using my hard work for income generation without my permission, nor reward for such allowance. If there is money to be made by blogging, I want a piece of the pie they are making with my content. Knowing when to draw the line in the feed department is getting harder and harder to define. Hopefully, this discussion will help define that line and protect our content while allowing non-commercial, private use without pain and suffering - on both sides of the blog fence. I echo the thanks, Jonathan. The issue for me is not just controlling where my content goes, but controlling who makes money from my content, especially content that comes from my WordPress.com blog, from which I cannot make direct income. The abusers of my content can.

Such usage breaks the “Ask First” manners of the web, using my hard work for income generation without my permission, nor reward for such allowance. If there is money to be made by blogging, I want a piece of the pie they are making with my content.

Knowing when to draw the line in the feed department is getting harder and harder to define. Hopefully, this discussion will help define that line and protect our content while allowing non-commercial, private use without pain and suffering – on both sides of the blog fence.

]]> By: Michael http://www.blogherald.com/2008/04/14/the-shyftr-saga/comment-page-1/#comment-407745 Michael Mon, 14 Apr 2008 19:48:08 +0000 http://www.blogherald.com/2008/04/14/the-shyftr-saga/#comment-407745 I think if Shyftr from the get go had republished full feeds, made republished feeds off limits to search engines, and not enabled commenting, the outcry would not have been as great. Any kind of widespread republishing that is indexed by search engines and moves discussion away from bloggers' blogs is going to get a thrashing from large percentages of the blogosphere. I think if Shyftr from the get go had republished full feeds, made republished feeds off limits to search engines, and not enabled commenting, the outcry would not have been as great. Any kind of widespread republishing that is indexed by search engines and moves discussion away from bloggers’ blogs is going to get a thrashing from large percentages of the blogosphere.

]]> By: Ram http://www.blogherald.com/2008/04/14/the-shyftr-saga/comment-page-1/#comment-407685 Ram Mon, 14 Apr 2008 19:13:01 +0000 http://www.blogherald.com/2008/04/14/the-shyftr-saga/#comment-407685 Thanks Jonathon for the great post. The latest move from them is not going to satisfy many bloggers. Let us see how this evolves over time Thanks Jonathon for the great post. The latest move from them is not going to satisfy many bloggers. Let us see how this evolves over time

]]> By: Mark Evans http://www.blogherald.com/2008/04/14/the-shyftr-saga/comment-page-1/#comment-407423 Mark Evans Mon, 14 Apr 2008 16:31:19 +0000 http://www.blogherald.com/2008/04/14/the-shyftr-saga/#comment-407423 Jonathan, Thanks for the legal insight. My sense is that Shyftr could be the straw that broke the camel's back in the sense that many bloggers have been fine with RSS because it has been seen as a way to expand their brands and grow distribution. But now that the conversation around their content is happening in other places, some bloggers may start to question a decentralized content ecosystem. Shyftry just opened a can of worms in a big way. Jonathan,

Thanks for the legal insight. My sense is that Shyftr could be the straw that broke the camel’s back in the sense that many bloggers have been fine with RSS because it has been seen as a way to expand their brands and grow distribution. But now that the conversation around their content is happening in other places, some bloggers may start to question a decentralized content ecosystem. Shyftry just opened a can of worms in a big way.

]]> By: Raoul http://www.blogherald.com/2008/04/14/the-shyftr-saga/comment-page-1/#comment-407321 Raoul Mon, 14 Apr 2008 15:32:54 +0000 http://www.blogherald.com/2008/04/14/the-shyftr-saga/#comment-407321 A quick correction. It seems their new rule is to display the shortened version of a feed item only if there is discussion on it at Shyftr, not at the original site. My own post on Shyftr, stolen from my feed, is still displayed in full at Shyftr despite having gathered plenty of comments on my own site. A quick correction. It seems their new rule is to display the shortened version of a feed item only if there is discussion on it at Shyftr, not at the original site. My own post on Shyftr, stolen from my feed, is still displayed in full at Shyftr despite having gathered plenty of comments on my own site.

]]> By: Raoul http://www.blogherald.com/2008/04/14/the-shyftr-saga/comment-page-1/#comment-407318 Raoul Mon, 14 Apr 2008 15:30:49 +0000 http://www.blogherald.com/2008/04/14/the-shyftr-saga/#comment-407318 Jonathan, Shyftr's policy change over the weekend did little to appease me. It was just smoke and mirrors. As you can see if you look at <a href="http://www.shyftr.com/?openagg=4157&onlyagg=1" rel="nofollow">my feed as displayed on Shyftr's site</a>, they're still showing the full content of my feed articles, which I find entirely unacceptable. They've reserved the right to display the full content of feed items where there are no comments on the original site. That's ridiculous and it's still an infringement of my copyright as far as I'm concerned. Since they have not removed my feed from their site, and they haven't used excerpts to display feed items, I still intend to go through with my DMCA take-down notice. Jonathan, Shyftr’s policy change over the weekend did little to appease me. It was just smoke and mirrors. As you can see if you look at my feed as displayed on Shyftr’s site, they’re still showing the full content of my feed articles, which I find entirely unacceptable.

They’ve reserved the right to display the full content of feed items where there are no comments on the original site. That’s ridiculous and it’s still an infringement of my copyright as far as I’m concerned.

Since they have not removed my feed from their site, and they haven’t used excerpts to display feed items, I still intend to go through with my DMCA take-down notice.

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